Introducing AppA11y, a new app developing company with a focus on accessibility ... and we want your game ideas

When you said turn-based games, RPG's always come to mind. Also, are you going to be going towards text-based games, or are you able to create audiogames?

There are no games that focus on football, baseball, or sucer similar to the one for sighted people. War games action such as submarine hunting another sub, flying a fighter, driving a tank to destroy other tanks. We are limited to word games and such. You want to make a impact do the above suggestions.

I'm going to second the rpg's request posted above.

Hello Lee and welcome to AppleVis.

I don't have any suggestions for you right now, but I did want to pop in and wish you all of the best with this new venture.

There are a lot of passionate gamers on here, who I am sure will be extremely excited to see where this goes. So, do please keep us updated.

Best wishes, Dalia

Hello,

I used to play a game called Myst on my Mac. And recently, Room on the IOS. While these are both very visual oriented, they could be adapted to work with VO. In each panel or scenario, you could have a narrator describe the room or scenario. Then the user would explore by touch to see what is in the scenario. If the user wants to open or explore the item, they can double tap to expose the content or move on. What would make this better would be the inclusion of sound affects.

You could also look at Sim City or sim tower. With some imagination, those games could be adapted to work for the sighted and non sighted folks. I can tell you many people here look for games that I just described. Come up with something like that and you’ll have plenty of followers.

HTH and good luck.

I hope it is a video games but, has some sounds effect or sel voicing that tell us what hapen in the game.

I think it's fantastic that another company is getting into the game of creating apps that are specificly designed with VoiceOver users in mind. However, I think the chosen name for the company needs to be reconsidered. I could probably write about a 20000 word essay about my dislike for this whole use of a11y. Using this name means little to the people outside of the twittersphere, and some of the people on twitter don't even know what a11y actually means. For those unfamiliar, the short version is that on twitter, you only have 140 characters to work with, so someone, i'm not even sure who, thought it'd be a neat idea to come up with a short version of the word accessibility, and made it a hashtag. So they decided to use a11y. If you count, after the a, there are 11 letters before the y in accessibility, so, a 11 y, get it? I suppose i'm fighting a losing battle on this one but I've always thought a11y was far too geeky for the average person to understand. Most sighted app developers have absolutely no idea what the term means, so when you write to them using a11y, they aren't clued in so it goes completely over their heads. It's just far too geeky and inside for the people who need to understand it the most. Having said all that, I don't want to be completely negative. Like others have said, if you want to really make an impact, it's a good idea to corner a market that's not already covered. We have dozens and dozens of word-based games. That's been done to death. What would really be great is if blind and sighted app developers could work together so that the very same games our sighted counterparts are playing on our game consuls and iOS devices are accessible. Like I say I know my comments are probably going to come off sounding very negative, but I'm not saying any of this to be mean, i'm actually trying to be helpful, even if it might not seem that way. I want for VoiceOver users to have as many games as possible, but when the average person sees the name of the company, you're going to have to explain what a11y means. If you have to explain it, then it might be a good idea to change the name to something like, out of this world games, or something that is completely different. We need games like baseball, football and other things like that, and other games like people have already mentioned.

Please make some Sim like games! Sim City! Sim Zoo! Etc

good old Scrabble. I do not know what the logistics would be for a blind player but isn't that part of the fun?
Toonhead, thank you for educating us on the meaning of a11y. When I got enlightened,I thought it was a neat idea following the accepted notations for internationalization and localization (i18n and l10n).
Good luck to AppA11y!

Thanks, i'm glad at least someone knew what I was going for, in regards to a11y. Something like that is acceptable on a social network, but when you try to take a11y into the mainstream, and it has to be explained...it just doesn't have the same effectiveness. This is why I suggested a name change to something that has nothing to do with accessibility, access, or anything else. If we want to be included in the mainstream, we have to think and act like the rest of the mainstream does if we're to be taken seriously. Of course, there are limits to this but I think you guys know where i'm going!

I definetly want sim type games like restaurants parks and township. Even sim city.

I hope you will create some shooting games. or fighting games. have music and sounds and some self voicing that helps us to play

I wish to have accessible flight simulation app, something like ThreeDVelocity or recently Eurofly.

Ok, another unpopular opinion here...please no self-voicing games? We have VoiceOver for a reason...if the games are going to have voices that aren't recorded by a human being, lets use VoiceOver for them. I don't see why this wouldn't be possible.

I too would love an accessible flight sim. It'd be tricky, but really really cool.

I'm a long, long time gamer of the sighted world, even though my vision makes it hard to get the full enjoyment. This may be an unpopular opinion, but a lot of audio games really fall flat when compared to games for the sighted. I'm wondering about the logistics of working with current game developers to make existing games accessible on IOS. I'm particularly thinking of the adventure games genre, which are usually "point and click" so to speak. Games like the Longest Journey, Broken Sword, or any other games of that style could be made accessible by ensuring players could use voiceover to click on or cycle through hot spots in a location, or their inventory, or dialog options. I know this is possible because there has been the occasional adventure game like this which is accessible. An old one called Time Adventures comes to mind. Games like this are very rich in atmosphere, story and puzzles, and it might be worth partnering with a developer to see about making such games accessible. I realize licensing might be an issue, but since the market for audio games probably isn't huge, it might be worth a look. There's alsoa fantastic visual novel called 999: 9 Hours, 9 Persons. 9 Doors by Spike Chunsoft and published by Aksys Games which has a great deal of potential in terms of accessibility. One of their other games Banchee's last Cry is accessible, and I think it could be possible to make this one playable also. I think people would really enjoy it. I realize none of these suggestions are turn-based, but they aren't exactly heavy action either.

Well said Remy_C the issue is however when contacting mainstream game developers is we often get the responce thanks we will pass this along, and you never hear anything else from them. I think that once the Unity plug in is perfected hopefully it will allow us to get better games.

My favorite type of games are sim games, so my suggestion would be like sim city, restaurant games, virtual pets, stuff like that.

I understand that some of the big name publishers might be less than forthcoming, but what about independent de3velopers? In my experience smaller teams tend to be a lot more responsive when dealing with quiries from John Q public. Harvester Games, Phoenix Online Studios, and Wadjet Eye games might be worth contacting. Also I have spoken to Chris of Unimatrix productions several years ago pretty extensively, and he expressed some interest in accessible games. Might be some worth-while jump points.

That is I, a dreamer! I dream of a game that a blind person can use that isn't designed to mimic what a sighted person sees, Yet, uses silly sound effects instead of reality! Give me a racing game that has real racing car sound effects! Give me a baseball strategy game with a crack of the bat! A baseball game where I can shape an argument between Billy Martin and George Steinbrenner! Find a way for me to play an old favourite Game of my cited days called: snake! Or tank! Give me these games with binaural quality recording techniques! Figure out a way for a blind person to play grand theft auto! Ha! I know, I know: impossible right? That is precisely why I don't play games for the blind anymore! They are boring!

Hi. While I commend you on your ideas of putting accessibility first, why did you have to pick a name for the company that forgive the pun, is so blind oriented? I'd honestly have more faith in a company which has a normal name, but puts in their mission statement, "our commitment to accessibility is first and foremost when designing a game." Right there, you're telling people, you're whole project ideas without sounding so as one commenter put it "geeky." Anyway, I'd love a punch out sytle game, maybe bringing back soem old school if you can get the rights, nentendo sound effects or something. That was the only game i used to love, could go all the way to I tink guy number five, before my ass was handed to me. :) Anyway good luck on your content production. Remember, last commenter, though you have wonderful pipe dreams, all the expensive ideas, would cost money and we all know how blind are tight with a buck. ;) not hooting you down, just a comment.

I agree 100%! I'd love to play GTA, Super Mario etc! The one video game I can actually sort of play since I spent so much time with it is the Super Smash Brothers games. I'd love to see something like that.

Please, please put out some kind of sports management games. Soccer, baseball, football, whatever. Just please put that out there. And with the names of actual players, not these fake names. I've wanted to play the FIFA ultimate team games for a couple years but as expected, not accessible. What a surprise. Another game that isn't accessible that could be. Just please, put those games out.

Could you please look in to creating a game like Virtual Villagers or City Island? It would be amazing to have the opportunity to play something like that.

Big Cat has it 1000% right! While most games made for blind people are fun for a couple minutes, they really aren't realistic. That's not to put down the work of the developers of these games, but seriously...the stuff sighted people are playing is in a whole other univerce compared to what we've got. I do think it would be kind of fun to introduce sighted folks to audio-only games, though, because lets face it, they have ears too, and with practice they could get pretty good at them. But the only trouble with that idea is that sighted people like good graphics and images and everything else kind of goes out the window after that. The sounds are certainly there but they're there for texture, and they don't rely on them the same way we would. But I agree. This whole "games for the blind" thing needs to end. Make games that anyone and everyone can play, disability should not be a barior.

hey! I totally agree that don't create games just for the blind. but, video games that blind also can play! I recently playing PS4 and a fighting games call street fighter and kking of fighters. these fighting are quite accessible. even they have a lot to improve. but, I still can play it some point. I hope in the future you will develop great games that all people nomatter who is blind or not. also can play it as well.

I disagree why should sighted people be able to play our games when we can rarely play theirs? We can make games for the blind better if the game makers make the games we actually want, as well as making the type of games we never had the chance to play. One example of a game that broke a lot of barriers for the blind is called Swamp. Swamp is a zombie shooting game for the PC and it uses a 2D map system. So why can't we have more games like the sighted world? It seems like a lack of trying to me. I suggested a game to be made for IOS and the developer said I don't know how to make that playable for the blind. After giving suggestions on how it could be done my comment was ignored. Perhaps if more sighted games become playable by the blind in the future I'd be more open to games for the blind being playable for sighted people.

If you offered suggestions as to how to make the app more usable for blind folks and the developer ignored you, that's on them. Unfortunately, there's a disconnect. Some developers don't even think blind people can use iPhones and probably believe our emails are written for us by a sighted person. No, I am absolutely not kidding when I say this. It is true, some developers are just really uneducated when it comes to our abilities. That's why I was saying what I did. as far as swamp goes, that's a game that a lot of people who are blind play, because it primarily uses sounds. Sighted people want graphics and wizz bang images that catch the eye. We want stuff that catches the ear for obvious reasons. If all you've got is a white background and a bunch of noises, sighted people just ain't gonna play a game like that. They simply aren't. This is why people want for sighted and blind players to work together. This way, you'd have the wiz bang graphics and images that sighted people enjoy, while blind people can enjoy the great sounds, and with some accessibility added, we can be equal participants. Maybe i'm over-simplifying things, but this is about leveling the playing field. I would love to go out and buy a Xbox, plug it in and start playing a sighted person without them even knowing that i'm blind. That would be a great experience.

Okay, so perhaps it's a byt cynical to say that, but considering the coding/ consulting and whatever else might go into making some games playable by the totally blind, I'd be surprised if implementing wouldn't cost more money. And unfortunately, the demographics probably aren't there to increase a game's profit because more blind people can play them (especially since I hear so many blind gamers moaning about paying for games) .

With that out of the way, I'm not saying developers can't implement accessibility. In fact, there is a game called Code 7 currently in development right now for the PC which, though it is a "sighted" game, is working to make accessibility a reality. it's an interactive text adventure with graphics, full sound effects and music, and voice acting. I've played the demo for it and, while it does not yet implement "all" the gameplay features present in the sighted game, it does a lot right and is very compelling so far. I highly recommend checking out the game. Just search for code 7 on Kickstarter (already fully funded). It's a prime example that such games can be made to cater to more people.

A Hero's Call is another game which implements accessibility and sighted graphics. In this case, it's the opposite scenario. It was an audio RPG with a heavier focus on story than one usually gets with most audio game RPGs. It was developed by two recently blind gamers who felt as many of us do, that games for the blind just aren't up to par with the mainstream. The kickstarter did so well that they are able to implement graphics to open it up to the sighted world as well. Not sure how many sighted people will actually play it, but it is a great step in the right direction, and the voice acting and music at the very least sound pretty great so far. It's currently slated to release the audio version first, then the graphical upgrade for everyone later.

Which brings up a main issue with accessibility; the type of game we're talking about. I think there are a lot of games out there that probably couldn't be made accessible as easily. Someone mentioned Grand Theft Auto. Hate to say it, but that's probably not a reality at this time, because it's such a wide open game. But fighting games, many types of RPGs, "point and click adventure"games, and (though I have never played one) some simulation games could probably work. There are also more experimental titles that I'd love to see be expanded on. There's a game out there for IOS called Heathcoat, which is a completely audatory paranormal/psychological ghost story - and though short, it's a bloody good one, even for sighted gamers. My wife, who is by no means a gamer even enjoyed playing it with me. The potential for interactive storytelling in the gaming medium is vast, and I believe it can be potentially enjoyed by sighted and non-sighted alike. There is absolutely no reason both parties can't collaborate and cooperate to make something accessible for everyone, and still be enjoyable. As a writer myself, I'd love to get involved with something worthwhile that all could enjoy one day.

Jeff, you'd like sighted games accessible? Fabulous. Except for the fact, that the game engines sometimes used are for the get-go inaccessible. As in, there's no way in hell they will work. Plus, I go back to my original idea, most of you, in general, are so tight with a buck, you'd make a booger come out of Washington's nose. Inother wors, a lot of people want free first, sacrificing the resources. As I said earlier, we're lazy pigs. We bitch about games not being accessible, Mario, Auto, and others, yet do we take a half a minute to write a developer and say thank you? Of course we don't. Our soap boxes are so high, it's honestly no wonder why we get screwed. So I'd suggest if you want sighted games developed, either keep eamiling that dev until you get an answer, or if the game is especially made in Unity I know this not accessible, swallow it and say, ok. Yes, the other poster before Toonhead was right. I like games for the blind, Fruitpot for example, but in the end, I want real competition that can see me.

@Siobhan please go and reread my post. What I disagree with is making our games playable by sighted people. If they aren't going to make their games playable why should ours be?! Also technically they can play ours but they won't as many of you said. Also why should they when they have all the amazing games they have. @Toonhead the developer that ignored me makes games for the blind pretty ironic. I won't say who it was however. @Remy_C exactly! If the resources are not there to make a sighted game accessible, why should the resources be there to make a blind game accessible for the sighted? Lastly I only used Swamp as an example of what audio games can be, and what we should push for in the future.

I used to play a game called Wizard's Castle. I haven't been able to play it since XP! I tried the DOS Box ap but can't get anything to work on it, so a game like that would be sooo fun! Thanks for all you do,
A

If you could develop an accessible app based on a Civ game it would definitely be very popular. Civ games are very hot with cited gamers lately

@big cat you said what I couldn't find the right words to yesterday. Jeff, really get your head back in the sunshine and not where it's probably currently stuck. It's oppinions like yours that are trashing other hard work done by developers. I love the idea of the consultant, because maybe the developer can say ok if the unity engine isn't working let's see if we can make a game to the other nitch. The more you isolate yourself, the less happy you'll be. If we don't speak up, nothing will get done. As an example, I'll tell you what happened. I was in an Uber, stay with me, and got dropped off in the middle of the street. at first, I wasn't going to say anything. Idid, got a refund and an apology. So I spke up, got something done. If we keep alienating the developers by complaining, or getting frustrated by what they will or don't do for us, is it any wonder they don't respond? We can't be kind, we have to wave our "we're disabled", flag. we do that every time we find something inaccessible or want it better accessible then it is.

Hi. Is that the game you can play on a Mac, and the intro is about some guy saying he is thinking about his kids? They weren't kids exactly... I'm asking because I did start to play that on the mac, but it was confusing.

I think a lot of you miss understood my post. My opinions in no way are trashing work done by other developers. I am in no way saying the games that exist and are being made for both the sighted and the blind are bad. Nor do I want to curse and punch inanimate objects. Let me start out by saying that sighted people have well working ears. In that respect they can already play our games! However they either don’t know they exist or don’t want to try. As nice as it would be to live in a world where all games are created equal for everyone to play that sadly is not the reality of it today. There are religions and other minority groups still being discriminated against today us included. It is much easier to be given a label then it is to remove one. Having apps made to be accessible for us is by no means isolation! Until the day when some piece of technology comes along or coding that can allow us to play all games we have to keep making games for ourselves as well. That is the only way that we will ever get the quality of games we want. When we try and make games that can be played by both sighted and the blind it takes more work, and a lot is lost gaming wise. Money needs to be spent on graphics and more coding is required. Also considering that the audio gaming market is so small most sighted people will likely never find our games even if they can play them. I can see the idea of being able to play games with our sighted family members and peers but going around and making all our games playable by sighted people I don’t think is a good idea to do for every single game. To the person that told me to get my head out from where the sun don’t shine I wish I could! Growing up I’ve attempted to play countless video games and of course there were only 1 or 2 I actually could. The games that really got my attention and that allowed me to slip away for hours playing them were made for the blind. The harsh reality is that this is a visual world and we are the minority. Should we push for more accessible games? Absolutely! Should we sacrifice the quality of our games to do so? That is where I disagree.

Yeah that would be cool the not looking at the phone thing. I mean minority from a statistical point of view pointing to the fact that its a visual world but it doesn't effect me negatively.

Hello,

Wow. A developer asks for a turned based game and everyone goes off topic. Anyone notice the developer is not even posting?

We should step back and put things in perspective. Games like GTA, Overwatch, FIFA will more likely never be accessable. There are too many moving parts for VO or ssound affects to explain. For example, if a bad guy is hiding and you have to look for him, while other players on your side and opponents are engaged in battle, how would that work? Or how would you know who to pass the soccer ball to when there are over 20 moving elements on a very large field.

Also being blind isn’t the only accessability issue to deal with. What about deaf folks? Don’t you think they wish they can hear the roar of a crowd? Or screeching tires? So with that in mind, developers are creating accessable games, but they don’t realize blind folks wants to play games too and the ones that can be realistically be made accessable for the blind should be encouraged.

I hope the developer is still around and tells us what kind of game he is hoping to create.

I would love to see more education based games for grades K-5. Things like Starfall http://www.starfall.com/ and ABCMouse https://www.abcmouse.com/. Sighted kids have all kinds of learning games that are used in school however there are very few choices for our blind kids. I know there are a few options out there but there are tons that are used in schools everyday.

Also I would like to see a fun typing game created for kids. This would include fun typing games to keep the kids attention while learning typing. I know that there are already typing programs out there but most of these are very boring for kids. We need to jazz it up a little for them.

Let's see if we can make learning fun for our blind kids too.

Ok, some more info about us (AppA11y.. and yes, the name is staying for now.. sorry Toonhead).

I apologize for not responding to the thread earlier.. but we have been focused on development..

This thread spun a little out of control.. so to summarize what we are doing...

- The company is not focused solely on creating games for the blind, although I'm not sure how that would be seen as such a bad thing. Either way, that is not the case. The company is focused on creating games that sighted and blind can play together. Meaning first and foremost, the games have to be fun for everyone.

- The games will use Apple's UIAccessibility framework as the only source of making the game accessible. We have no intention of using our own voices in the game. This keeps it scaleable and relevant when Apple adds new features.

- Sorry, but for now there will be no RPG or fancy fighting games. Maybe when we can actually hire some employees that can happen. For now the plan is to create a suite board,word,puzzle type games that everyone will enjoy, and where people can socialize, chat, compete.

The first game being released will be an interactive word search game where you can play others in real time, or single player. As well as socialize with others. it also includes some fun twists that make it different from any other word search out there.

As far as the name of the company goes.. maybe we can change it in the future.. but it's pretty much a moot point anyway. If the game is good.. people will play. I've been doing this long enough to know the name carries no weight in the app store. Thanks for the feedback though, Toonhead. You brought up points I hadn't thought about.

Last thing.. who wants to test? Toonhead, you are already testing another game of ours... interested in testing this one?

Just send an email to support@appa11y.com and you will be added to TestFlight.

Thanks!

hi, a flight sim would be a good idea. I think windows but there isn't one for mac or ios

Will sighted people really go for an idea like this? There are so so many word-based games out there. You've got so many people here telling you what they want to see, yet you insist on doing this word-based game stuff. hey, you can't say we didn't tell you what we wanted in a game.

I definitely give my full support to Appa11y and their app developers! I really enjoy everything about their first game! I think having a variety of word games available is a good thing! I think creating word games is a good starting point! I'm looking forward to seeing what Appa11y has to offer in the future!

JoAnn

Oh boy. Here we go. I'm not gonna say anything other than that that last comment sounded incredibly patronizing. And in my experience, that doesn't make a company look good, regardless of what services they offer.

Was not patronizing at all. I have known Toonhead for a while... reaching out to him offline.

There is no football game that is accessible so if you want to make one will be great and use by many of us.

Ok it's getting a little intense in here, but i haven't been here in a while and wanted to voice my point o< view. I don't love so many word games either. There are just so many of them, the category is drying um and getting dull. But if you're willing to create accessible games in the future, then why shouldn't we be supportive of that? You may not love every game a developer creates, but if testing it means it may help for future games i'm willing to give it a try.