iOS 7 Bugs: Will They Ever be Fixed

hi, your answer to fixing bugs as of right now is a no. apple seems to have fallen asleep on the job when it comes to fixing issues like the voiceover focusing issue and as far as when you write to them, you just get blown off and passed over. this is the reason I am leaving in february to android, lets face it people, google seems to get what there customers are saying with talkback, and improving it, where as voiceover remains ever bug ridden and not improving at all. whether some want to hear this fact or not it's true, despite what some have argued on here android is useable everyday, yes, some apps aren't accessible as iOS, but honestly if apple doesn't get there act together, then they are going to be finding them selves on the losing end of blind phone subscribers, especially if kitkat makes a huge step forward in accessibility.

A lack of patience is one thing that a lot of blind people seem to have. Microsoft takes ages to squash bugs that should have been fixed before an operating system is released. For those who expect immediate extermination of bugs, I wish you would consider the complexity of the task. In this case, it is far easier to request it than to deliver the wish. Folks, please, we've got to give them time!! Quit griping! If you have some constructive, and this is the key word, send it along to those who can make a difference. And, after you do, how about waiting for them to wade through the feedback before you bite their heads off for a lack of response? Doesn't the fact that there have already been two updates tell you anything at all??

while i tend to be on the more negative side of things when it comes to apple, IOS7 has allowed me to reconsider things a bit. now, this does not mean that i am now what could be called a fan boy, far from the truth, but i am more positive about apple. IOS 7 has been the best software upgrade i have ever done. i have had an Iphone for 2 years now and have been in it since IOS 5. i had a jail broken iphone for a few months before upgrading to IOS 7 and the first thing i did was add a control center, then i got rid of the spotlight search, which bugged me to high heaven when it would pop up when i would accidentally hit the home button to many times, and allow my folders to have more than 12 things in a folder. now that apple has allowed this to be integrated into the regular old software, i like the plain old operating system better. thats not saying that there are things about apple i don't like, and android does have IOS beat in several huge areas but, IOS has, for me, gotten better. now to talk about the bugs in voice over. yes the bugs are annoying. some of them i could live with. that doesn't mean i don't think they shouldn't be fixed. to the contrary, i am all for getting them fixed. however i will make a comparison here. saying that the NVDA verses JAWS debate is similar to the IOS verses android debate isn't a far stretch of the imagination. to me, jaws releases things in there new versions of their software. however, they don't seem to fix old bugs and update code for modern things. for example. they are just now releasing jaws 15 which finally supports touch screen devices and windows 8.1. yet windows 8 has been out for more than a year. NVDA has had support for touch screen devices and windows 8.1 for the longest time. there code is updated far more frequently than the code for jaws is. it is easier to shove in a new feature than to try and trouble shoot a problem that may or may not be replicated and may or may not even fix it. this is what both apple and jaws are doing shoving new features in with very little reguard for fixing things in the passed when talking about bugs. going back to IOS, people have said that there are bugs that are in voice over since IOS 6. so lets try and figure out why these bugs haven't been fixed. i see several options why. 1. they don't know. i find this highly unlikely. firstly because blind people usually have one of the loudest voices when something bad goes wrong in the blindness world. if something brakes, trust me you will hear about it with in minutes of people finding out. plus, i have seen countless reports of someone saying that i have reported such and such to the accessibility team at apple, and it still isn't fixed, or something similar. 2. they know about it however, they are unable to fix it yet because they haven't figured out a solution in order to fix it. while somewhat likely, apple would want to higher the best and the brightest people to code for them. if the code for voice over was that complicated that it takes people over a year to fix simple bugs, there needs to be a huge rewriting of the code for voice over. 3. finally, they can't fix it and/or they wont or don't care. if they are unable to fix these issues, apple needs to higher new people. also, i have heard reports of bugs that are still plaguing IOS since IOS 5 which is about to years old. two years is a very long time. also take into consideration that blind people can be very, as i talked about above, loud when something goes wrong. sometimes on the point of almost being belligerent. i'm sorry, but if you ignore people like that for almost two years on bugs that need to be fixed, thats pretty sad. on the android side of things, as i've said before on many occasions, both android and IOS have there draw backs and both have there advantages. by no means is talk back perfect, and by no means is voice over perfect either. i'm not going to go into the advantages of android over IOS because, i've done that in other places, and this isn't the right topic. however, i will say that google has impressed me more with not only there business model, but the way they handle talk back and the method in which to interact with your device is way more intuitive. there several more, but this post is getting long enough. in summery, i fear that if apple doesn't get up off there proverbial high horse of every thing is happy go lucky and we are the best of the best, and look around at what is happening around them, they are about to get bit in the backside and lose out on a seat at the table of the future of computing.

Hello All, I have read both sides of the fence on this thread. It is time to add my two cents. IOS7 is a totally redesigned platform from the ground up. It isn't like the transition from IOS 5 to IOS6. It is a different kind of animal. Ask any developer; let alone a blind developer. Some developers have had to redesign their applications from the ground up as well. Yes, there are bugs; but there will always be bugs and that is how it goes with Apple, or any device maker for that matter, this is nothing new. All of the bugs are relative though as some are not seen on some devices, for whatever reason, and some just don't get in the way of an individuals daily use of the device like my self for instance. Patience is needed as several individuals have given tangible proof that apple fixes bugs. Are they fixed in a timely mannor? Again, that is relative, what is an acceptable time frame for one might not be for another. Is Android closing the gap? Maybe, but all I have to do is use one of their apps on my IOS7 platform and flick through the app counting the number of unlabeled buttons to form my own opinions on how serious they are taking accessibility. Patience people, it has only been 10 days since the GM release of IOS 7 and rome was not built in a day, a week or a month even. To sum up my two cents, I will paraphrase from one of my favorite podcasters, if you want to talk and text; get an android, but if you want to do more; get an I-Phone. Apple has not forgotten about us, things just take time and in this ever increasing, give it to me now world(what have you done for me lately), patience is lost out there. On one other note, can I just say that I am incredibly tired of Brandon. His posts with respect to apple have been nothing but negative. Brandon, just go and get your android and be happy then, because we don't need your countless posts about android here. If you haven't noticed; the site is called AppleVis. Go be a fanboy on android access or something like that. -Andrew-

okay people. we just need to settle down and let the steam dissipate. this shouldn't turn into a firefight. i'm going to address a few things here and hopefully you all understand. firstly, i do understand that blind people aren't the only people when we talk about the blanket term of accessibility. there are deaf people and motor impaired people as well. however a good business model would divide the accessibility team so part of the team would be working on just one aspect of the whole accessibility suite within IOS. so that people can focus there work on one area and not have to continually jump back and forth. while i don't know if that is the case, one would hope that would be the case. next, apple has built themselves a pedestal upon which they can stand and look down on us like the tiny people we are. they have created this image of we are so high and mighty and we are going to be the best of the best and no one will stop us in that pursuit. they have acomplished this some what. however, lets look at apple's track record. lets look at this accessibility team. they seem mostly to be good about getting back to people, however, i also hear people say that have repeatedly contacted the accessibility team and never hear back. so its hard to know what to believe in that situation. next, there ability and/or track record of fixing bugs. i have mentioned before that 'we are still encountering bugs in IOS that are still around since IOS 5 and 6 which are pieces of software that are over a year old, almost two years. the fact they haven't fixed these bugs now is completely inexcusable. not even mentioning the bugs in IOS 7. while i do know that it was a completely new overhaul of the IOS OS, i'm very astounded that these bugs weren't caught. what were they doing, sleeping on the job? let me give an example here. i own a house and my roof starts leaking. like any sensable person i call up a company so that they can come out and fix my leaky roof. i call them and i hear back from them , but they never show up. time passes and i continue to contact them and they say they will be there and they are working on scheduling me in, but they never show up. by this time its a few months later, completely fed up with the first company, i call a second company and they come out within a day and fix my roof. so i'm back under my leak free roof nice and dry lounging on the couch. the first company is apple's accessibility team. they say they will fix things but months, if not years go passed, and the bugs are never fixed. i'm supprised if some of the bugs will ever get fixed by the looks of things now. the second company is google and the eyes free team which develops talk back for android. i have found them to be very reseptive not only to fixing bugs, but to adding new features. they push updates very frequently and fix bugs in a very timely manor. where apple's team, its even questionable if they will ever fix some of the bugs in IOS right now. lastly, i would be highly a posed to the deletion of comments on this sight. i could see the situation for it if someone was being disrespectful to another user, or abusing there rights on this sight, but if all people are doing is posting civil comments about a different operating system and going about it civilly, i don't see any harm in that. for example, if there was a site for vegetarians and some people who were not vegetarians started posting on the sight, but going about it in a civil manor, there is nothing wrong with that. on the contrary, i would think that it would be an abuse of power on behalf of the site admins to start deleting comments. all we are doing here is exercising our right to free speech. if site admins are going to throw there weight around and start deleting comments i'd say that's abusing there positions and that could be classified as something not very far from censorship. hopefully you all understand where i'm coming from here.

I quite definitely agree with many of the other posts here, but I'd like to add my thoughts here as well. 1. Firstly about the iPhone verses android thing, Mr. Armstrong just needs to go get an android and be happy. He is painting an incorrect picture about android, there are many bugs in that operating system as well, and when something isn't fixed that he thinks should be, and if, for some reason, google doesn't fix it fast enough, then I don't want to hear about it. I'm not saying google and android are bad, or even sub-par, please don't misunderstand me on this point. What I'm saying is that there are many bugs in android as well and when you buy a phone with either OS on it, you take a chance of having some unsquashed bugs, and you learn to work around them! Android is not the perfect, end-all be-all of operating systems and he is a fool to think it is. He insists that's not the case but his posts certainly seem to say differently. He is fast becoming what people on internet forums call a trole. 2. As for iOS 7 I also agree, patience is what's needed. I am disappointed that some long-standing bugs from previous operating systems weren't crushed, but you know what? I dare any of you to build a better operating system with accessibility features built in. This is not something you can just push a few buttons and create, boom boom boom. Apple is a big company and it's very nice that they included accessibility into their operating system, they are to be commended. But I'm about to tell you guys something that a lot of you aren't going to like but it's the truth. We are a minority. Unfortunately minorities don't get their problems pushed to the top of Apple's bug list, no matter how loudly we scream. We need to work around these bugs until there are fixes for them, and if there aren't we need to do our best to make Apple aware of them, and keep doing so until they are fixed! Ok. those are my thoughts whatever they might be worth, 2 cents or otherwise.

Nicholas, You ask if you think if Apple is really giving us the time and the attention to actually resolve the current and past iOS problems. Personally, I do think they are trying and yes I do think they will resolve issues as more updates will come out. People will have to understand that the 7.0.1 was for the Touch ID problem on the 5s and that the 7.0.2 was to resolve the serious flaw when the phone was supposed to be locked with a passcode. So as with any release of a brand new iOS. We will just experience issues and bugs. This is a very natural and normal thing. As we had seen for the iOS 5 and the iOS 6. Those contained a lot of bugs as well. The further in us got with update. The more stable it got. I mean I personally thought that 90% of the bugs were riddle out for Voice Over users when we got the 6.1.4. Those are just my opinion of course. Nothing can or will ever be perfect. So I have no doubt they will come out with better and stable release of the iOS 7 in due time. If I recalled iOS 6.1 didn't come out until January of 2013. It just takes time. If anyone writes to the Apple Accessibility Team will and should receive an e-mail that clearly states that you may or may not get a response. This doesn't mean they aren't reading it. I can assure you of this. Plus, this is a normal and typical reply we would get from Google, Amazon, Microsoft and such. So this isn't just an Apple thing. The more details you give them the better. As with many places. They will need to successfully replicate the problem. Many moons ago. I was a programmer. If I couldn't replicate it or get enough information. The harder it was for me to resolve and fix. Sometimes, sadly as it is. If I couldn't replicate it. It just didn't get fixed. However, I think with anything else. The more tickets we received for the same problem. The higher of the chance it had to get this resolved. We just had more tickets than we had time. So the higher priority was the ones we focused on in getting fixed. Everything just couldn't be fixed before we had to move on to other projects. Now this is only my experience. So Apple may be entirely different. So take this with a grain of salt. As one has mentioned on here is that we have to remember that the Apple Accessibility Team has to resolve many other issues besides those that are blind. Plus, sometime a team may have multiple functions. There was a time that people were pulled from one project to another and then back to what we're doing before. In all honestly, I have no idea where or how this became an iOS vs. Android subject. As both devices do have their pros and cons. This site is AppleVis after all. It was designed for people with Apple devices. Not to say we can't ever discuss about the Android but this is like talking about your Chevy at a Ford dealership. This will ruffle some feathers. So you have to expect that when a subject like that comes up. If people think Android is great and wonderful. I am really happy for you. That is great. I wish all the best for you. I have no desire to discuss in what I think of the Android because it would be pointless and mindless to do so. We all have opinions and we all think we are right. Also, I have no desire to get in to mudslinging comments and such. So no I don't think Apple has dropped the ball at all. This is just my two cents. I still very much believe that Apple is a solid product. They provide awesome customer services. They continue to innovate. The devices and products are made with the most superior quality. Plus, it has been a blessing and I am so grateful that we even have something like this in our lives. My life as a blind infidel has changed so much. It has helped and made things easier for my life. I can't imagine what blind inviduals had to deal with 20 years ago? Or even 10 years ago! I love that we have choices and we just have to pick what we think works for you the best. So hang in there Nicholas. Just keep sending those problems to Apple. Encourage your friends to do the same. Remember to give them as much details as you can. I can only hope for the best for you. Cheers, AnonyMouse

here is the problem i find with all this. when ever someone says anything about a bug, everyone is just like contact apple. but what about, no, contact apple. however, what has all the contacting gotten you? they can't even fix bugs that are more than a year if not two years old and the latest IOS has dropped the ball on accessibility in the biggest way ever. i'm sorry, but i would like apple to fix some of these major bugs before they gain some of my respect back.

You know, as I read this topic I begin to wonder whether part of the reason for not making as much progress as we would like on issues such as this is threads like this. We all have opinions, we all have various annoyances, but I have to say that some have expressed themselves in the most unhelpful way. Allusions to tiny people and high horses are unlikely to win us any friends. For myself, there are issues with IOS 7 that are annoyances. The touchscreen sensitivity is one, the change in location of the delete key is another, Siri's idiosyncracies is another. However, that's all they are. have I missed out on information because of the slight problems with the Voiceover focus? no, quite honestly I have not. You may have, but I have not. Is it not quite as I would like it to be? I suppose that would be a fair summary of the position, but it's not something I'm losing any sleep over. I am prepared to wait, and again speaking for myself i would far rather Apple fixed the very serious issue there was with the passcode before turning to matters like this. I note what some people have said about Voiceover bugs' being present for a couple of years or more. I have used an iPhone for over three years now and I can't say this particular problem has really registered on my agenda, but I take the point. In answer, I would echo what has been said about IOS 7's being built from the ground up. It really has been a major redesign, perhaps something that blind people understandably don't appreciate so easily. I am told it looks very different anyhow. Given that, I have to say that the fact that the vast majority of things work, and indeed work very well (better in some cases than on IOS 6)) is enough for me to be content to wait. All things considered I have a brilliant device that allows me to control my Sky+, read the latest book releases in perfectly rendered UK braille, play a vast selection of games and access my professional documents in a way unthinkable only three or four years ago. I'm happy with that and will wait for the rest for a fair while longer. I have no observations on Android. It hasn't figured in my thinking, but I daresay if you prefer that operating system it isn't a crime, and with my Tory Thatcherite hat on I can only say hurrah for the free market and consumer choice.

So here's the deal… A lot of people talk about how the iOS and it's supplemental accessibility features is a complex code… It is going to take a long time for bugs to get squash… But here's my main gripe. Many of the bugs that a lot of people are experiencing with iOS 7 are bugs that would not go overlooked if the product have been properly tested. If the following specific bugs are in fact universal… I have no idea how you could miss things like voiceover not announcing folder badges, accessibility issues when composing a new message (however minor these maybe), lack of accessibility when flicking through your favorites list, etc. etc. I've said this here so many times but I'll use my own bug report as an example… Back in July I reported the Safari issues that many of us have been having on the Mack OS… Around the time I reported this bug I also talked to other visually impaired Mac users who have reported the same bug. They said that the accessibility team told them that they could not replicate the bug on their computers. For about 2 to 3 weeks Apple accessibility Tried to blame the Safari issues on flash animations… even after my first email… Which explained how I encountered and worked around the bug in great detail… They acted like they didn't know whether or not I was using voice over on an eye device or a Mac… My descriptions were very clear and described precise voiceover key commands that are native to the Mac operating system. Finally… When I told them that I sat down at a MacBook Pro at an Apple store and was able to reproduce the bug right off the bat… All of a sudden they were able to reproduce the bug on their computers. This makes me think that they were being rather dismissive to previous claims… And had not truly and scientifically tried to replicate the issues that a lot of us have been having in the first place. Maybe they launch Safari once and it didn't happen so they thought that they were in the clear. Also… Asking administrators to delete comments that mention android is typical Apple fandom. Many users of Apple products (either cited or blind… Able-bodied or disabled…) Have the potential to become deliriously loyal to the company thanks to their marketing techniques. Things like the control Center and notification center were on the android operating system before Apple ever include them in the iOS. I'm not trying to play favorites… Just speaking truth. It never hurts to know the truth. Sure… Plenty of companies have copied what Apple has done with their iOS devices… But Apple is not above that. I have no plans to switch anytime soon but I am interested in trying android devices. The consensus seems to be, however, that android is great for basic phone functions but iOS offers you so much more. It seems like even with all of the bugs that currently plague iOS 7 Apple is still the more accessible choice. Also I think it is important to remember that people are well within their rights to complain about various aspects of Apple technology as well as how Apple operates as a company. This site is a site dedicated to users of Apple products who are visually impaired and blind… But there is nothing that says we have to gush over everything they do. Personally… I am one of the lucky ones who was still able to downgrade to iOS 6.1.4… I think is absolutely ridiculous that people had such a small window of time to downgrade. I think people should be aloud to downgrade two previous OS whenever they want. Apple's reasoning for this is probably something along the lines of "well as software advances older versions of the OS will not keep up and will start to miss behave…" But that's absolutely no reason to take away the option of downgrading. I have also heard that many of the ports on Apple's devices actually have driver chips associated with them… So if ports are malfunctioning a lot of the times you have to replace the entire motherboard… Which is completely ridiculous. I am not so familiar with this last issue… So please somebody correct me if I'm wrong. Otherwise… As stated in previous comments. We are unbelievably lucky and blessed to live in an age where this kind of accessibility exists in such mainstream technology. My consensus… Apple is a company who makes technology and happen to be really good at implementing accessibility. Beyond that though… They are just a company. They are not impervious to flaw. They should not be followed blindly. It is important to keep an observant post and note any changes in their demeanor or behavior. Although I wish them continued success… Who knows… 10 years from now they could have collapsed due to internal disintegration. Oh and just to reiterate… Just because we are minority doesn't give us any less of a right to complain about accessibility. By that logic the civil rights movement was one big cry fest. Some of you may think this comparison rather outlandish… But think about it… Just as minorities have fought for the rights to vote, become educated, and generally integrate into mainstream society… Us disabled folks have the same right. We have just as much of a right to get equal usage out of an operating system as anybody else. For those of you who still think this comparison crazy… Just think of all the day-to-day tasks that everyone else in the world does that you would be excluded from if you didn't have access to whatever operating systems you work with on a daily basis. These day today – tasks are imperative to modern communication. We've got to be strong, sensible, positive, and confident. We also have to be patient and tolerant… Well I do have my skepticism about Apple accessibility's quality control… I do understand that fixing bugs takes time. Also if the company is just beginning to implement accessibility features into an operating system is not going to be perfect the first go around… So you have to be patient to allow them to get things right. Such as been the case with Google for the past few years. But when there is some evidence to indicate that the accessibility team of a company who has been almost universally praised for their commitment to accessibility doesn't take bug claims seriously that's an entirely different issue. Unfortunately in the case of Apple… Multiple user reports have the potential to reflect these unfortunate circumstances. I hope this isn't the case… And I hope I'm proven wrong.

I recently contacted apple accessibility about a bug me and some other users have found in the 4s and the proximity sensor not always changing to the ear peace when answering a call, they told me they are building a case of complaints on this and working to get the right people involved to fix this issue, despite the bugs, I love apple and I do like IOS7. I was able to set my IPhone up without sighted help do to the tripple home key click, does other phone companies have this? I don't think so! I also think voiceover is a heck of a lot more stable than jaws! I just don't own a mac because I can't aford it right now or I would.

I am so disillusioned with the recent OS offerings from Microsoft and Apple. It seems we have gone backwards on accessibility features. I bought a new Asus tablet with full Windows 8 which proved to be unusable with Narrator on as many essential features did not work. The tablet is now in a cupboard awaiting Windows 8.1 in the possibly forlorn hope that I will be able to use it after the update. I installed IOS7 on my iPad and am now experiencing many of the reported bugs with VO on including Safari crashes, erratic focus, freezing for several seconds etc. I was a programmer in a previous life and I well know the problems with fixing bugs. It is all too easy to fix one bug and introduce three more in some seemingly unrelated area. Very careful planning. implementation and TESTING is essential. Microsoft and Apple are huge companies employing the cream of the IT world and with a customer base in the millions. There is no excuse for releasing an OS with such basic bugs. Many of these reported bugs are common and reproducible and should have been picked up in the testing phase. It took me literally seconds after installing OS7 to find irritating bugs. I find it incredible that these were not fixed before the release. Microsoft and Apple need to calm dow, fix all known bugs in the current OS before rushing headlong into a poorly tested radical new OS, just to try and protect market share.

from recent experience if you are setting up a new device from scratch, you must use a computer to get vo started. For the curious, I found out by following the steps below. 1> use iCloud to erase your phone. 2> turn it on. No audio do you get even when pressing home three times. No revolving spoken languages, nothing till you begin the process via the computer.

I have not used Android devices and my only experience with IOS has been with my iPhone 4 (just ordered an iPhone 5S) - but if the Android phones are so much better and intuitive in terms of accessibility, my hat's off to Android, because I find IOS 7 has some excellent improvements, many of them covered extensively in Applevis, after updating to 7.02 I am not having any of the issues I initially had with 7.0 - also I listened to David Woodbridge podcast on IOS 7 which I would recommend to anyone updating. Yet reading some of the comments written here, some might get the impression that the iPhone and IOS 7 are horrible - I just don't get that. I know some of the bugs are specific to some models and settings, but for my experience, Apple has made some very nice enhancements and I much prefer IOS 7 to previous versions. If Android is better, well kudos to those who have it, I am pleased enough with what I get from Apple devices that I have no compelling reason not to stick with Apple.

Siri will not accept input till it is set up. Once it is and it is a voluntary thing just as is voiceover, anyone can command it to do these neat things.

Ah, okay. Thanks for the information.

A few days ago I became so frustrated with ios7 on my ipad4 that I bought a Samsung Galaxy. If you think you can take the device out of the box, turn on Talk Back and away you go, you will be disappointed. I will try to be brief with some of my initial experiences. Many pre-installed apps are not Talk Back friendly, like the web browser and Polaris office suite. You will need to hunt for TB friendly alternatives. I am still looking for a document reader that can handle more than just.txt files. Touch navigation is crude and hit-and-miss, for example, tapping on text (or a button) reads that text but if you want to hear it again no amount of tapping will read again. You must tap elsewhere to read something else then you can return to the original text to read again. There is no gesture for continuous reading other than shaking the device which rarely works. Talk Back is definitely a work in progress and I am sure it will improve with future updates, but for now Voice Over wins by a mile. I just hope Apple fixes the bugs in ios7 so I can get back to some frustration free use of my iPad. If you are still thinking of a switch to Android, try and borrow a device or at least ask the dealer to turn on Talk Back and have a play before you buy.

the reason you had so much issue with the galaxy is because samsung does a lot of skinning and custom installing of there devices. with there custom apps, skinns, and plus touch wiz isn't the most tb friendly. your better off with a more stock experience. i will tell you with my nexus 7 i bought. i took it out of the box,, hit the power button, held two fingers on the screen, and i was off and running with talkback. you will see this reflected in my previous posts. yeah, the fact that you can't go and retouch something like that is a little annoying a bit, but thats the beauty of android it will get fixxed really quickly if you report that if you want it. unlike IOS where software is crammed with bugs, and bugs are still rampent 2 years later and never seem to be squashed.

Android does not belong in this thread. Pleas either take it to an existing android thread or start a new one? Thanks!

It's responsibility not sensitivity that has me going forward. Android is an interesting topic and you can read and discuss about it in many forums. This forum is for apple products pure and simple and I've not the time nor the inclination to wade through other stuff. If I were to discuss jaws on a voiceover list, I'd get thrown off, likewise with window eyes on a jaws list so have a heart, cut me a break, lessen my load and I promise, I'll follow android discussions elsewhere.

This thread is about ios7 bugs and new problems caused. I was very interested to read that Android may be a viable alternative with Talk Back. I am sure others were also interested. If this Android vs Apple discussion is moved to an Android forum are we going to get someone claiming to be responsible for shutting down the discussion because Apple cannot be mentioned on an Android forum? If the thread does not interest you, then unsubscribe. Let's all chill out.