My review, why I returned to iOS from Android

iOS invests in accessibility for Google doesn't. An prime example of this is keyboard support. You can accomplish everything using a keyboard that you can on iOS using the touch screen. You can't do this on Android. Lets take actions on android as of Talk back 13.1 you can't interact with the actions for android using a keyboard. You also can't spell check using a a keyboard on android in Talk back 13.1 I've requested better keyboard support since the eyesfree days and also contacted support for samsung disability they couldn't understand what I meant even after providing both links to iOS keyboard commands and there own and saying you need to add more keyboard commands. Google doesn't care. Apple builds accessibility in from the ground up. Google it is an after thought.

To those having problems have you called apple accessibility let them gather logs and do a screen recording? Without these things they can't be fixed.

When you try to activate them it doesn't work. Bottom line is Google has proven through actions they don't value accessibility as much as Apple.

plain and simple it is not as accessible as iOS.

If you want a basic phone that allows you to do most things go with android. If you want good accessibility go with iOS. iOS has advanced things like spell check better braille support developers are more willing to make their apps accessible with voice over. with iOS you have screen recognition and image descriptions you don't get this with Talk Back. You also get voices like Eloquence on iOS. You can't get that on Android.

If you want premium accessibility go with iOS. iOS has excellent keyboard support and the Braille support is better then talk back. Google takes years to attempt to catch up and hasn't have you tried spell checking with a blue tooth keyboard on android? if you try these things it has you will find it doesn't work. Android will never catch iOS. iOS innovates Talk Back does not.

Somebody who has an iPhone 6s Plus a Galaxy 80 for S and Edward go pixel seven I’ve got a group with one point Dennis. Eloquence doesn’t work any more, well, at least an android 13. The reason for this is eloquence is ready to be at Karma and android 13 dropped support for some 32-bit apps. I’m wanting to see if Blaine help.net can make a 64-bit version of android, possibly. Because I still want android on my Galaxy and my pixel.
Braille I don’t use, so I can’t comment on that.
Spellcheck I don’t even edit my things on iOS, so who sings I would edit on android. I actually think some apps are more accessible on android. Officeworks is marques dB Spotify, is marques Estable,

I used it in my iPad 9, nothing to write home about it. It is much better in my windows 10 with jaws than iPad and VO.

Joshua

I sent you an email from my account, check your inbox

I too agree you on this because I recently switch to iOS and I feel that keyboard is more responsive than android. I am more impressed with swiping on the keyboard it automatically detect the text and insert into the edit field.

Talkback doesn’t crash, well, at least not yet on my phone, and that, my phone is a low range phone number for gigabytes of RAM and 128 GB.
Should slow, but it doesn’t crash.

JOSHUA!!!THIS IS THE LAST TIME i WILL RESPOND TO YOU. FIRST MAYBE YOU SHOULD GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i HAVE AND HAVE USED A S21 YOU CAN'T DO THOSE THINGS USING A KEY BOARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SO GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i ONLY RESPONDED BECAUSE YOU ATTACKED ME IF YOU RESPOND I WILL IGNORE IT AND REPORT IT!!!! MAYBE YOU SHOULD TRY WHAT YOU CLAIM WORKS USING A BLUE TOOTH KEYBOARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! TALK BACK IS A BASIC SCREEN READER AND IS NO WHERE AS POWERFUL AS VOICE OVER

Even though it’s slow, it will last me for the next two years.
And I don’t is Bluetooth keyboard to Braille displays.

Here is the android list.
https://support.google.com/accessibility/android/answer/6110948?hl=en
Here is the iOS list.
https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/use-voiceover-with-an-apple-external-keyboard-iph6c494dc6/ios
Every platform has issues. If Google were iOS everyone including the blindness organizations would be complaining about the lack of accessibility. It is time Google is held to the same high standards Apple was to make Apple the leader in accessibility. Yes Apple has issues but so does Google. I am hoping in iOS 17 that a lot of bugs are smashed.

If you have a mid range, iPhone version of red range galaxy phone. The med ranged iPhone has this crashing issue but you can use the galaxy device fine
What is shame Apple? What a shame.

Thank you for confirming what I had stated. Clearly there are some fan boys here of Android that won't be honest and admit where android falls short.

Hello.
Having been an Android user and recently getting my first iPhone, I have the following points to share based on my experience:
1. For the users who said that TalkBack doesn't crash, they certainly have never experienced using a low-end phone like my Galaxy A10. TalkBack crashing was one of the most common things, especially in Chrome.
2. Regarding it never stopping talking, just like in the first point, in my experience, this is not true. It happens, for example, when I didn't touch the phone for a long period of time and then didn't receive any feedback.
3. In terms of stability, I completely agree. The focus of TalkBack doesn't jump around the screen like VoiceOver does.
Since I switched to the iPhone, I have never noticed VoiceOver disabling itself or things like that, just a considerable delay in response that happens randomly.
Best regards.

Thank you for confirming what I had stated. Clearly there are some fan boys here of Android that won't be honest and admit where android falls short.

Android fan boys? I’ll have you know I was literally with Apple for like seven or eight years. I’m not a fan boy I’m stating the truth.
And Miguel, you said.
1. For the users who said that TalkBack doesn't crash, they certainly have never experienced using a low-end phone like my Galaxy A10. TalkBack crashing was one of the most common things, especially in Chrome.
I also have a phone which you can sort of coal low to mid range, a galaxy a zero for S what’s up gigabytes of RAM in 128 GB. I have none of the issues. Some of these people are talking about. Talkback is a little slow though, but I imagine it will get better over time.

Was watching a video about iOS and news of the week by guy from 9to5 stating that more android people move to iOS this year so far. I would like someone who has both to do a podcast from getting them and starting VO or talkback. and so on. The sane apps demonstration in both would be good to see.

https://www.techradar.com/news/android-fans-are-switching-to-iphones-in-record-numbers-heres-why
I am not a fan boy just honest Apple has better accessibility and innovates Google does not look what is coming to iOS 17. Google will never catch up. Could they? yes but Google has shown they don't care about accessibility for all. actually read the differences in keyboard support and you will see the point.

If I recall android did not play nice with HID for Braille. They originally agree with apple, microsoft and themselves but later change their minds. Is that accessibility that they care? NO.

I agree with you 100000000000000% Does Apple have problems yes all companies do but at least they listen and do fix bugs. it might not be as quick as we like but they do listen.

@Joshua, feel free to do whatever you like, but your action doesn't hide the fact that TalkBack, even on high-end phones, is affected by many bugs and issues. TalkBack mainstream app support on Android is nowhere near that of VoiceOver, and Google needs a lot of catching-up which, despite their recent announcement, is absent from their actions and releases. You are not the only one who has tested or used Android - I've also used it on phones like Pixel 7 Pro and Galaxy S23 Ultra, and the experience wasn't nowhere near that of VoiceOver on iOS.

I agree with you. Thank you.

Let's face facts people. Apple sucks at things, google sucks at things. Nothing will be perfect. In fact, My thermostat has been offline for more then a month, because after changing Wifi networks and password, google was to stupid to say hey, your thermostat is offline, change network? Yes. Find it, enter password, done. Nope? They want you to do a ton of crap I could care less about just to get it going again. Bottom line, tech companies are good at things, crappy to be G rated at others.

FYI, Dennis is an advanced Android user. So he knows a lot about Android accessibility. The fact that Android accessibility lags its iOS counterpart in many areas such as equivalent keyboard access, AI features, auto-picture descriptions, Braille, extended Rotor features, prominent third-party/developer recognition, etc., can't be disputed by flooding the comments section of this post. This is my last comment on that.

Then you can choose not to use Talkback, like I did, and use Commentary, which is much faster. But even so the iPhone experience is always better. For example, I had Advanced Braille Keyboard installed, and sometimes when I used it it didn't work, I had to reset the keyboard to default and then put ABK back... in short, Iphone has a more fluid and integrated experience.

I have a Galaxy S20 FE 5G. DoorDash works very well on that phone. Evidation works wonderfully. I can play video games. TalkBack is snappy, and rarely has issues. But I can do a lot more on my iPhone. My NLS EReader works with the phone, allowing me to type and read silently. Image descriptions are good on the iPhone. And, here's the biggest thing. Someone wrote a book on using the iPhone, using the iPhone to write the book. All the way through. When Android gets to that point, then it'll be on par. A person I know uses his iPhone, with VoiceOver, for almost everything he does. Android users seem to use their PC's for most everything they do. Oh also TalkBack and the accessibility framework are miles behind VoiceOver on what apps can do. How long have apps been able to define direct touch areas in their apps? Since, like, iOS 10? Apps can't do that with TalkBack. So users have to turn TalkBack off in games. And then? How will the game talk to them? Oh no, now they have to make their own screen reader. And that, y'all, is why Mortal Kombat has accessibility features on the iPhone, and not on Android. And developers will *remember* that. They are not gonna sit there and go "okay let's build this screen reader in our Unreal Engine for blind Android users." No. They'll keep looking to iOS and fixing stuff there. Like this is a real-world use of phones. You know where gaming is finding a boom? Mobile. And you know who has steadily built, over the last 10 years, a platform and accessibility frameworks that allow these games to give us blind people a great experience? Apple. Because not only can we access the gameplay portions of Mortal kombat. We can access user interface elements too, with VoiceOver. I don't have to turn Voiceover off at all during the entire app experience, unless I'm doing a "show your might" segment of the game, and that's only because the developer didn't make that a direct touch area, and not because of any flaw in the accessibility framework. And like, I love Android. I love the idea of Android. Freedom, installing any app I want, video games, all that. But because of Braille support being where it is, the simple framework that doesn't allow for direct touch and sending text directly to TalkBack, including to the Braille display, and oh yeah Google Play Books *just* got the ability to turn to the next page automatically when reading with TalkBack. As in, a month ago. The Books app has had that forever. Like, they've got a lot, and I mean a Lot, of catching up to do. And as Apple showed last week, they aren't standing still either. Oh also Google will support the NLS EReader in TalkBack 14. Over USB. No Bluetooth. You don't believe me? Just wait. It's pretty sad.

I completely agree with you.

by friends and ATI instructors alike. One of the first questions out of the gate I’m going to ask readers will be the following regarding the time frame reader has used and owned an android device. Lastly, a challenge to those who read my article showing by proof a task can be done on android and IOS.

So, let’s begin with rumors and myths.

I can not edit text via text message as easily on android as I can IOS. I mean, with IOS I can twist my finger to word, character, and sentence flip down. Android takes 3 fingers two swipe down, does not always work. There is this menu when everything needed to edit text under actions accessing these brakes my productivity. Just a quick twist to characters flick down back space quickly edit text. The above statement predicated from falsities could not be further from the truth. So, to edit text on android one simply swipes left or right with three fingers or up or down. Once the chosen selection is made swipe up or down with one finger to character needs to be deleted press backspace. It me be a different method but still gets the job done. It’s harder to select text on android but IOS easier to select text. False, method of navigating to select text with android can be found in actions menu it called start and select text. In this menu select all can be found as well. Just swipe up or down, left, or right depending on your set-up of jesters. Once you hear actions swipe up or down with one finger double tap which task is going to be performed. It’s hard to text with an android with no split tapping, cannot double tap letters when typing. False, Talkback now has ability to set typing to double tapping letters, lift to activate and a few other keyboard settings. Apps are easier on IOS to use than android, while each operating system has different basic navigation methods tapping, double tapping, exploring, and swiping are the same. While Motorola, Samsung and Google may have a different vision of android talkback’s gestures remain the same across board.

Challenge time

Name 3 day to day tasks visually impaired users can do on IOS but the tasks cannot be done on Android. When receiving my answers, I’ll answer in same likeness.

Hello!
I'm going to share my experience in a more detailed and practical way to show my point of view regarding Android and how the iPhone has brought me more benefits.
First of all, as I mentioned in my previous comment, my Android phone was a Samsung Galaxy A10 with 32 GB of storage, 2 GB of RAM, and Android 11.
Currently, I have the iPhone SE 2022 with 128 GB of storage and I believe it has 3 GB of RAM.
As I also mentioned in my previous comment, my TalkBack was very slow and it affected the performance of the device, especially when unlocking and opening apps.
But to be more specific, using social media on Android was a headache for me, as the user interface has a lot of buttons, for example, on Twitter. On Twitter, I go to the home page, find a tweet, go through 3 or 4 icons to save, like, and share, probably suggestions to follow and the next tweet, with the same icons, and the next tweet, and so on.
On the iPhone, I open Twitter, find the tweets, and navigate through them in a list, having the actions of the rotor in case I want to share, like, and so on, without those elements being presented to me on the screen, which, in my opinion, becomes annoying and disrupts the workflow.
Another aspect is reading long texts, like a large text message, which TalkBack takes time to read as if it has some processing time to process the text and read it, whereas on the iPhone, it happens instantly.
And the most critical aspect in my experience is web browsing because Android is in a battle between Chrome and TalkBack, who consumes more resources from the device? Chrome wins because TalkBack restarts without reason, and if it's a page with a lot of dynamic content, it becomes a challenge for it to process everything and navigate the page efficiently. On the iPhone, Safari works wonderfully well, at least for my needs.
But one of the reasons I prefer the iPhone is undoubtedly the Braille keyboard in Portuguese because on Android, I only had it in English or Spanish, and there were letters with special characters like tilde, acute accent, grave accent, etc. that I couldn't write, so I used voice typing to write a word.
In general, I think each one has its advantages and disadvantages, and we should make our choice based on our preference and usage.
Best regards.

This thread would appear to have degenerated into an argument between this person and that person, so I hesitate before adding what I hope is a constructive comment as I imagine most readers won't get this far down, but here goes: I'm fed up of hearing observations to the effect that the best thing is to have two phones. I'm happy for you if you can afford two phones. So could I, in fact, if I chose to. but I do think we should be a little more conscious of the fact that many can't. For a start, not everyone lives in an advanced and developed economy. that's not meant as patronizing - it's just a fact. It's therefore perfectly legitimate to ask which is most accessible, if you could only have one. For me, it's IOS all the way. If I explain why I'll just have the Droids back on the earhole telling me what a bleeder I am, so I shall depart from the rules of natural justice and decline to give reasons.

There we go, folks. Constructive right up until the last couple of sentences when I reverted to the mischievous.

Okay, I'll bite. I'll add my own constraints to this though. First, no CSR. No Commentary screen reader, just TalkBack. Second, the user has their sound mode set to sound, not vibrate or off. Third, this is with production software and hardware. No betas, no "well this will work in the next release" or anything. Fourth, no workarounds. No muting TalkBack, no turning off TalkBack to tap around the screen, nothing. Now, let's go!

1. A user has just gotten their NLS EReader Braille display. It's the Humanware model, and they want to use it to read and write on their Android phone now, after downloading some BARD books of course. So, they put their EReader in pairing mode, go to the Braille part of TalkBack settings, and try to scan for devices. But oh no, it's not there. Okay, I'll give a little and let's fast forward to like this fall, or next year in the case of Samsung phones cause Samsung's TalkBack is almost 6 months behind Google's. So the user pulls out their Samsung phone and tries to connect again, since they now have TalkBack 14. But oh no, it still doesn't work! Frustrated, they contact Google a11y support, who tells them they need to connect the EReader over USB. On their iPhone, a message dings. They connect to the iPhone with their EReader over Bluetooth, open the notification, and respond to the message.

Now, this is not some device that is just beginning production. This is a device that is in 40 of the 50 states of the US. This is a device that has been out since at least 2021. Now, Google should have been having this device. Google should have *been* supporting HID Braille. There is no excuse for this.

2. Talking to the Google Assistant without TalkBack talking over you. So the user puts away their NLS EReader. "Bah, I don't need Braille anyway," they say to themselves. "It just slows me down." So, they zoom around the Android interface with TalkBack commands, enjoying how snappy everything is. And then they want Google to open an app for them, since that takes a little more work to find an app. So, they hold down the home button, and TalkBack says "Assistant, tap to dismiss assistant." Meanwhile, the assistant is listening, and the user has lost track of what they were saying. So they try again, this time using "Hey Google." Still, TalkBack talks over them. Sighing, they leave the assistant alone and just go to the quick settings, find the search button, and type in a few letters of what they're looking for.

This is pretty bad. Even if you're using Samsung's TalkBack, you should be able to use Google Assistant without the screen reader talking over you. This is a testament as to how limited Google's accessibility framework is. Google, it appears, cannot even have its screen reader be quiet during an interaction. I remember when VoiceOver tried to describe an image while people were talking to Siri, people were quite rightly outraged. But when Google has the same issue? Oh just mute TalkBack, be a real Android fan! What? You can't take a bug here and there? You must just be too much of a Sheeple, you Apple sympathizer! Go back to your iPhone and think about what you've said! Now, onto the third one.

3. Image descriptions. So the user, resigned to doing everything manually, opens an app. They find a post from someone with a picture. The picture is unlabeled. They heard in TalkBack's tutorial about Lookout, and already installed it. So they hoped they could share the image to Lookout. They could not. There was no "more" or "share" button on the image. Feeling scourn and disgust, they pulled out their iPhone, opened the same app, found the image, and after hovering over the image for a second, VoiceOver described it to the best of its ability. The user then packed up the Android, sold it, and bought a pair of AirPods.

This one shows that Google just isn't an AI company. They've failed to show any promise in this area, through accessibility or otherwise. Just now, TalkBack includes icon description capabilities. VoiceOver can describe complete images. Google seems to think that their a11y ai junk should be in another app altogether. So users have to share an image with Lookout, if the share option is available, and have that app describe the image instead. Meanwhile, Apple's accessibility team have correctly figured out that, oh my actual gosh, people want the image described right there, not needing to send it out to another app.

And like I said above, I love Android. I love how snappy TalkBack is on my Galaxy S20 FE 5G with Snapdragon 865, 128 GB storage and 6 GB RAM through RAM Plus. But I hate how behind Google is accessibility-wise. I've used my phone for a year. Six months of that was nothing but Android. So I know just about everything about it. The workarounds that are always needed. Oh hey y'all, did y'all know we have to turn on the thing where your assistant gives you greater details and doesn't think you can see the screen? Except those switches don't tell us if they're on or off? Pretty darn bad.

1. Is this EReader I keep hearing about the product that amounts to the brailliant BI20X if you're anywhere other than in the US? and why in only 40 of the 50 states? is it still the Brailliant in 10 of the 50 states? And if you go across state lines do you have to call your EReader a brailliant and vice versa? what's the penalty for not doing so? is it a federal offence?
2. Can someone explain to me how to do formatting changes and suchlike on IOS? If I want to take up our friend Josh's challenge and write paragraphs - I've forgotten if they're green or their blue - how would I do it? I don't want to, incidentally, but I do want to know how. If Josh wants me to write an essay he's going to have to come up with a more interesting topic than that. seriously, though, I'd like to know how you do this. i suppose one can use UEB commands with BSI for bold and italics and suchlike, and that's one reason I really like UEB, but is there another way? And is there a way to fiddle about with fonts?

Who ever heard of writing a PHD on a mobile phone anyway?

Lol dude, calm yourself. The NLS Ereader has an exterior which is the same as the Brailliant BiX 20. The software, though, is different. It also uses a different Bluetooth identifier for screen readers, but does use HID Braille. So just adding support for the Brailliant does not add support for the EReader, or the Chameleon. And the reason they've not gotten to all 50 states yet is because they've just not gotten there yet. Also nobody gives a damn what you call it.

2. Talking to the Google Assistant without TalkBack talking over you. So the user puts away their NLS EReader. "Bah, I don't need Braille anyway," they say to themselves. "It just slows me down." So, they zoom around the Android interface with TalkBack commands, enjoying how snappy everything is. And then they want Google to open an app for them, since that takes a little more work to find an app. So, they hold down the home button, and TalkBack says "Assistant, tap to dismiss assistant." Meanwhile, the assistant is listening, and the user has lost track of what they were saying. So they try again, this time using "Hey Google." Still, TalkBack talks over them. Sighing, they leave the assistant alone and just go to the quick settings, find the search button, and type in a few letters of what they're looking for.
Thank God, I’m not the only one that’s experiencing annoying is heck talkback call Talkback talking over Google assistant
Also, I don’t even know how to mute switch on talkback.

I believe you double tap and hold with two fingers.

Josh, thanks for letting me choose the essay topic. I can, at least, play to my strengths that way - although unless I choose a subject about which you know I don't know how I'm going to receive constructive feedback and a competent grade from you. I realise your point is different fonts and colours and suchlike, so the minute someone tells me how to do that I will pen you a piece on the 2017-2019 parliament so sparkly it'll hurt your eyes to read it.

Devin, my comment about state lines and names was on the facetious side. Clearly, not taken in the spirit in which it was intended - a salutory reminder of one dimension of Brookfield's criticaly reflective lens (Brookfield, 1998). But you can't leave me hanging like that: looks like a Brailliant, feels like a brailliant, tastes like a Brailliant (for all I know), but isn't a Brailliant? So what are the other differences? and why can't those in the US just make do with a Brailliant? It's a damn fine product, I promise you that.

One of the main reasons I switched to Android back in 2020 was that I was just bored of iOS and wanted to try something new. There were positives, like being able to just copy paste my music from the computer to my phone without having to deal with iTunes, and being able to add an SD card for more storage (which is no longer possible with the new Samsung phones). I really missed the responsiveness of voiceover though. I switched right before Apple added the image description feature to voiceover, which was eventually why I came back to iOS. I wish iOS was more open like android.

Well, Bingo! You got it! They don't just provide the thing cause they want it to be a reading device, and not a writing device. So no editor, no calendar, just a book reader, date and time, online services, battery, user guide, and power off basically, oh and settings. So yeah they just locked it down a bit more.

When I was last using android, I had a Galaxy S20. Talk back would crash, and freeze up, all the time in chrome if it was a larger website. That phone had 12 GB of ram, and 256 GB of storage. No reason for it to lag or crash just browsing around basic websites. That's just bad programming.

Question with iPhone out of the box, pressing side button and asking siri to turn VO on a person can start playing with the iPhone. Can you press the side button and ask google to turn on talkback to play with the pitsel or android?

For Google pixel, you either compress the volume up button inside button, but volume up and volume down buttons, or put two fingers on the screen and I guess pinch your turn or something I don’t know. You can do this on the set up screen.
Both on my pixel and my 804 I have needed sided assistance to turn on the screen reader.
That I don’t mind if I can deal with it.
I’ve got a map to set up of the phones, are very easy as long as you can get the grip of the gestures, which is why you should do the talkback tutorial on first bit of talkback if you’re in experienced an android

I read his message about all of android's short comings and it is true. Apple also innovates Google doesn't so Google could add the missing things in a year in theory I probably wouldn't switch back. That bug of Talk back speaking over the assistant has been around for a while. I'm sure people have contacted Google accessibility they still haven't been bothered to fix it.

Voice over offers better support for those that need or want to use a keyboard I know for a fact I've reported it to Google accessibility desk for years. When a Company doesn't do anything you can come to one conclusion based on actions. They don't care. It isn't a priority for them. That is not a company that will earn my recommendation or business.