Hello everyone,
Not sure if this is the best spot for this thread, but I can't think of anywhere better.
I'm looking for a good bluetooth keyboard, specifically built for Windows. Meaning, I don't want one that was made for mac, and when you go to use it in Windows, key mappings are off. I would rather have a smaller keyboard, but it must have home, end, page up and down, even if that is accomplished via fn and arrow keys. I don't want or need a numpad though. Also, quiet keys would be nice, as it will be used during radio broadcasts.
I've purchased several keyboards in the past, though don't remember the specific models. But, on some, there was no function lock, so in order to use function keys as standard, you had to hit fn along with it. Just give me standard windows function keys, not these other shortcuts that a lot of manufacturers like to assign to the function row. Then, when I finally found a keyboard that had the function lock, come to find out, that keyboard had no home, end, or page up/down. Major problem, as I use those a lot in certain Windows programs used for broadcasting.
I need to do something, as my current wired keyboard is just a bit old and clunky, takes up more space than I would like, and gets picked up when my mic is on. Hopefully there is a nice affordable option that will also meet my requirements. I know some of the Logitech keyboards might work, but some of those run a bit more than I would really like to spend. If one of those is really the best option, I'll go for it though. I look forward to your recommendations.
By Justin Harris, 12 February, 2025
Forum
Windows
Comments
Logitek K-380
The Logitek K-380 is a cheaper keyboard that should do what you want. It's similar to the K-780, which I own, minus a number pad. You do have to use function with the arrow keys for page up/down/home/end though.
One note about the keyboard. By default, when you pair it to your Windows machine, by default F1 through F12 will be mapped as specialized keyboard keys, which you've said you don't want. However, you can toggle the function of those keys so that F1-F12 behave normally via the Logitek Options utility. The utility is a little strange, but it's usable with a bit of fiddling.
Hope this helps.
@Gar Thanks. Will probably…
@Gar
Thanks. Will probably eventually invest in one of those. In the mean time, I did come up with a decent work around. Since I never use the backslash key, I remapped that to Home on my HP350 bluetooth keyboard. Not perfect as placement is rather odd, but it is a key I never use, so, it works. I wish that sharpkeys would let you map key combinations, not just single keys to single keys. If that were possible, I would do fn plus arrow keys for all that stuff. But for now, Backslash it is. lol But I did take a look at the k380 and it looks like a good option.
I really like iClever
I can't remember my last one's exact model number but iClever makes pocket size folding ones that are surprisingly usable for their small size. They're probably more built for mobile but mine did have an fn key. These days my qBraille just does double duty so I'm not more up to date.
I have an iClever ic-bk10.
You wouldn't want that one because it has a number pad, but it's a multi-device keyboard. Works great in iOS, Mac, and Windows. Before I switched to Mac my Windows laptop's keyboard died, so I was using it with the laptop lid closed and it sitting on top of it. It has an fn key but IIRC the function keys are the function keys by default. Home Etc. are with fn-arrows.
I'm sure you can find one without a numpad. They also make folding keyboards and non-folding ones, this one is non-folding. It's nice, very thin with a metal body. The Logitech k380 is decent and fairly cheap, but I like the iClever for long-term typing better. It's a lot like a laptop keyboard and has full-sized keys, the K380's keys are smaller and closer together, not badly so, but it is something to consider.
Also the K380 only works on batteries, two triple A I think. The iClever has an internal rechargeable battery, which means you could connect it to a USB port on your computer to charge it up while you're using it, if it suddenly dies on you. Both are pretty decent keyboards though. Well, I'm extrapolating to whatever else iClever offers, but I can't think I got the only decent keyboard they make.
There is some noise though. A couple of things about that.
1. If your microphone is on the same surface as your keyboard, includes a setup like keyboard shelf with microphone on another part of the desk or on top of something on the desk, it will probably pick up just about anything. This also likely includes those arms that clamp to your desk.
2. Get your microphone right near your mouth and bring the gain way down, use something that let's you check levels, e.g. a DAW like Reaper, or something with autogain, the Audient Evo interfaces, though I've seen other things with that feature.
in general, people have their microphones set way too high. Trust me, I've done it myself. Especially if you have a large condenser, the temptation is to put it in front of you on the desk. Again, I'm doing it myself, my current setup is a Yeti sitting about three feet in front of me on top of my Mac Mini. I'm just using it for Skype, so it doesn't really matter. But if I were recording or doing broadcasting? Absolutely matters, if you don't want extra noise getting picked up.
Generally speaking, you want your microphone separated from stuff, e.g. on its own stand, think those tripod thingies, and close to the source, so you don't have to crank the input gain. That doesn't necessarily solve everything, maybe a really loud keyboard will get picked up, the clickiness is in the higher frequency range that tends to carry more. But those two things will make taming any noise way easier.
Thanks for the recommendations.
Thanks Holy Diver and Khomus for the recommendations. I'll check out that brand.
Khomus, as for the mic I'm using, I actually am using an Audio-technica BPH-S1 broadcast headset, similar to what a lot of sports casters use. I have this because at one point, my studio didn't have the best treatment. Still can't say it's fantastic, but better than it was. But having the mic so close does help to eliminate a lot of background noise. But the wired keyboard I have been using is probably almost 15 years old I'd guess. Very loud keys.
Like I said, for now, I got my HP350 bluetooth keyboard working and adapted to meet my needs. This keyboard has decent travel and tactile feedback, but isn't nearly as loud. Also, it has the advantage of being more compact, which is nice when you have limited space, a pretty big board, Focus 40 Braille display, plus the computer keyboard. But, when it does come time to get a new keyboard, I will give that brand a look. And I also know what you mean about people having their gain too high. It's easy to do. I haven't really had issues with other sounds being picked up, just the keyboard.
Not cheap
Not cheap but at the entry level of premium is Keychron's K series. I use their K2 which is pretty much what you describe, it's available in a few key switch options, and best of all the switches are hot swap so if one of them starts giving you trouble you can replace the switch instead of replacing the whole keyboard. I chose it after I had trouble with keyboards becoming unuseable just from a couple of keys becoming unreliable.
The K2 has a full row of F-keys, home/end/page up/page down, arrow keys and a delete/insert. The delete/insert can be switched using one of the built in key combos which you can find with a google search, one is always the default and the other can be accessed with the fn key. I also used an NVDA add on to remap the print screen key to the applications key. And as a bonus there's a sliding switch on the side to change between Windows and Apple layouts just in case, though I stick with the Windows layout.
I also strongly second the…
I also strongly second the logitech. I don't remember if I have the k380 or k480 though, I have a rooler like thing at the top left to instently switch between 3 devices, it doesn't have a numpad, and there is a weird hole in the top to put a thin tablet like in? It's a great keyboard, I received it in 2017 and it still works incredibly well and I was using it as my primary keyboard for 4-5 years at least.
The iClever is multi-device as well.
You switch with three keys past the function keys. It automatically figures out what it needs to do. So if you're using it for iOS or Mac OS, it does Apple. If you use it for Windows, it does Windows, you don't have to remap or anything, it does that for you. No applications key for Windows though. I think the Logitech keybard is the same in that respect, no applications key. SO that you might have to map to something else, if there's a free key.
Applications key is overrated
Those of us who remember Intel-based MacBooks, and BootCamp, will be right at home with Shift plus F10. 🙂
Shift F10
Shift F10 usually works but there are edge cases where it doesn't. It's like how sometimes pressing enter on an item doesn't always activate it, it isn't technically a direct one to one for the application key. It's also really inconvenient when you can just press one key and not have to mess with the combo, especially when that one key is often easier to find than an F10 on a more compact keyboard. That said I gave up on Mac OS after trying for a number of years because of how many commands required multiple modifier keys so if you're a mac user YMMV.
nah, honestly i wouldn't…
nah, honestly i wouldn't miss it if it were removed, it's more convenient but nothing shift f10 or a little mouse routing can't do
I always forget about shift…
I always forget about shift f10, but on keyboards that don't have the applications key, I just map right alt to applications, since I'm good just using left alt. I would prefer to have it and not have to fuss with mapping, but there are fixes for it when not included on especially compact keyboards.
Alternatives
While I cannot speak on other screen readers for PCs, with NVDA we have a nice little add-on called "input lock". With that enabled, we can lock mouse movement, but keep button clicks active. So that whenever we need the "applications key" pressed, we can just do a two finger press on our trackpad.
Same effect, easier to access.
No fuss, no muss.
However, I realize that's a lot of steps for some people, which is why I mentioned Shift plus F10 above.
What is one edge case where…
What is one edge case where shift f10 won't work? I'm very curious.
What is one edge case where…
What is one edge case where shift f10 won't work? I,m very curious.
Re:One edge case
It's rare enough I can't think of an example off the top of my head but it usually seems to be in cases where the software doesn't simply let Windows handle the control and insists on recoding it themself.
Hello, don't purchase the…
Hello,
don't purchase the logitech mx keys.
I have one and, despite keypress is awesome and I love it, unfortunately you can't make some keystrokes due to hardware limitation and, perhaps, mental dementia of customer assistance.
In particular, you can't make some keystrokes like capslock+shift+b, that NVDA uses to receive information about battery charging.
I opened 2 tickets about that in Logitech customer website, but you don't speak with technical staff, so if you ask to make a test with a software that captures keypress, they give up and you remain with your 100 dollars keyboard that can't make some keystrokes.
I have a friend who have a…
I have a friend who have a mx key and never talked about this problem. Very curious, can you maybe provide more detail?