My Experience with iOS and Why I Switched to Android

The LG V-20 is also another phone that has the latest Android version. It supports up to a 2 TB SD card. If Android made braille screen input, that would be amazing. That withstanding, there are things I miss about the iPhone, with is why I don't know if I'll stick with android for longer than 2 years.

It doesn't matter what something looks like; it matters what's inside. The iPad has had a virtually unchanged design for 6 years and no one has complained. I miss the headphone jack, for sure, but there are plenty of internal hardware changes that make the iPhone 7 worth the upgrade. Don't get me wrong, if every company had equal levels of accessibility, I'd be using a Windows phone, but Apple still beats all the other platforms. For me, functionality will always trump asthetics

To the person whos tarted this topic, what are some good android resources that would be useful? I do like the idea that AppleVis is a one-stop place for information resources and the like. Android access hasn't been updated in years, and the ways to get resources are scattered at most. ANy ideas?
Darrell

Just not AppleVIs admins. I'm a network/server admin, and I always dread having to connect an Android phone to our Exchange server because, for example, a Samsung Galaxy S7 has different steps from an S6, or a Motorola, Nexus, LG, etc and then you add in the carrier ROM variations. A sprint version of the phone in question won't connect due to stupid, unnecessary modifications and yet the Verizon version will... or sometimes it's the other way around, or sometimes they both work. Did this person's phone get this security update yet when someone else's (same carrier, same exact phone) didn't? It's a nightmare to support Android in a corporate setting. And then, when everything's finally working, one phone gets an update and suddenly it stops working. No errors, no indications, but this phone suddenly stops receiving email and even a factory reset won't make it work again. How many iPhones have been this much trouble? If you'd guessed none, you'd be right. Same for Windows-based phones, though we don't have very many of those around. But those Androids... I despise their unpredictability.

Hello,

A few things.

What is the upgrade life span on the Samsung Vs. an IOS device? For the IOS, you will get about 4 full updates. Meaning from OS 8 to 9 to 10, not the minor updates. And how easy is it to update? Don’t bring up installing ROMs because not everyone knows where to find the correct ROM let alone know how to install it.

How is the accessability support should you run into a problem? Can you call the manufacturer? While Apple accessability support may not be the greatest all the time, they are there and they try to help. IF you want to try the Andy OS, make sure you purchase a reputable brand so you get some kind of support.

Stability and security. While the Andy is great since you can customize and make OS level changes, it comes with some risks. I’ve seen some devices crash to the point a ROM reinstall was needed. On the IOS, the worse case is to recover your device by using iTunes or even going to an Apple store. IF you can’t recover your Samsung device yourself, do you know where to go? The IOS is also more secure because of the way it’s designed. You can’t do the things you can do on the Andy OS because they are locked down. Because they are locked down, the chances of you getting a malware, Trojan or virus is non existent. Which is more important to you, customization or security?
Don’t get me wrong, the Andy OS is a great platform. I have an Asus tablet and I’m glad I can update the ROM as needed but I wanted to point out that there are things you need to consider. If you’re a tech head or geek, go for it. But if you want somethings that works out of the box that’s easy to use, the Andy might not be for you.

That depends on the phone maker. With my Pixel, I can go to settings, and tap support, and either get a call from them, or chat with them directly

Does inclusive android still get updated?

And that is what I'm saying. I think that more goes in to the community at apple vis, because there are far more of us for one, and that with android, your kind of left to explore. on your own. It's kind of like JAWS scripting, but that is not a topic for apple vis.

You are correct with the inclusive android site. Back in the olden days when http://androidaccess.net/ was the central place for Android news, only one person was running the site if I do remember correctly. As for Inclusive Android, which I am one of the admins for, I admit it needs updating and reorganization in places. The last update to it I saw, was an unboxing dated the 26th of september 2016./ For anyone who wants the latest updates within the Android world in accessibility, and you don't wish to receive emails in your inbox do to the traffic, simply bookmark the "Eyes-Free" Android list instead: http://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/eyes-free PS. At least the Eyes-Free list is now "moderated" for the most part, Googlers stepping in when necessary.

I think it's good you shared your opinion. I started with Android and switched to Apple. You seem to be focused on Hardware not software (operating system) I frankly don't care about the appearance of the phone. I want a work horse not a show horse. As far as speech accessibility Apple is a clear winner over Android. I am an avid reader and love the accessibility of apple books. Interestingly, Google books have better accessibility on my iphone than they did on my old Android phone. I don't think it's a good idea for people to get 'religious' about this stuff. This is because Google is a highly competent, agressive organization and I would not rule out that they may outperform apple in the future and the important thing is that blind and low-vision people end winning.

When discussing Android, it's important to remember that it runs on so many devices from $50 to $950 tablets/phones, and different versions of the OS are customized by different manufacturers that you need to be a much more careful consumer if you go that route. My husband has a $50 phone which ran talkback out of the box, but with terrible audio. A friend had a $700 phone which didn't have Talkback; he needed to get a sighted friend to find it and install it from Google play.
Luckily my husband is sighted and the $50 phone works well for him; we just made sure Talkback was on there in case I needed it while he was driving.

But people's experiences will vary depending on what gizmo they have and what version of Android they run and what customizations the manufacturer provided or removed.

My experience, playing with a few Nexus devices that run stock Android and with my Kindle which runs a highly customized version is that the Talkback gestures take more practice, are more clunky and less responsive than iOS. Also there is less information available about whether a given app is accessible.

Because I wanted to be able to use and understand Android, and demo low-cost tablets to disabled students in my job, I selected the $50 Kindle and have been very happy with it for entertainment purposes. Reading audio books or ebooks, Using Netflix, Youtube, radio and music apps seems nearly as effective as on the iOS devices. And its support of Micro SD cards makes it easy to store all the entertainment there rather than having videos, audio recordings, podcasts, NLS BARD, bookshare, Kindle books, and Learning Ally audio books taking up precious memory space.

But for productivity, there's no way I'd use an Android device. Even on the Nexus which I borrow, with the newest Talkback, cut and paste is painful and error prone. BrailleBack reminds me of the Braille support back in iOS 4. Reading mail -- and I've tried several apps is just a less accessible experience as is web browsing.

For consuming content, I think Android has an edge, especially if you get a device with an SD card slot. But for the most effective and efficient accessibility, I'll stick with iOS for now!

Apple is indeed closed-source & proprietary. What it has done a reasonably good job of, though, is keeping malware-infested apps out of the App Store. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said for Android. As of 2015, a full 97% of all mobile malware was on Android devices. & Apple does seem to do a reasonably quick job of patching vulnerabilities in its OS when they're discovered. So from a security viewpoint, I think it's fairly clear that, at least at this point in time, IOS is the winner. & no--I don't have any affiliation w/them. Just another perspective that wasn't discussed much in this thread. IMO, it's just easier to be productive when you don't have to deal w/an insecure ecosystem.

Hi all,

I think that this topic is very interesting. I would also like to give my own opinion with respect to Android.
I went to a phone store with a friend and I asked the store clerk for an accessible phone. When this person turned on the screen reader feature on a demonstration Samsung Galaxy S6, I was instantly joyful because that screen reader was so intuitive and user-friendly that I was considering buying one for myself. This was in 2015. Has the Samsung Galaxy S7 screen reader matured during the Android N update? Is Samsung going to address accessibility concerns that we might have during the release of Android O or not? Do the Samsung phones still contain a home button just like the one I felt on the Samsung Galaxy S6, a button which, unlike Apple's home button, is rectangular-shaped and is, quite honestly, more tactily-discernable than the iPhone's home button? I would like to install multiple TTS engines, such as the popular Eloquence TTS, but Apple doesn't let me do it. Why?
Have a nice day,
André

Until last year there was no way I was going near anything that had a touch screen. I had a flip phone running Code Factory and that was just fine for me. What pushed me towards getting a smart phone was the games, and the idea of having a good GPS app on my phone. I’ve had some moral issues with Apple in how their devices are often made by child labor. Yes I know that most technology, clothing, even chocolate is now but for me it was a big moral issue. So I got past that after 5 years or so and decided that if I made my smart phone last for a few years it would be worth it. I personally like Google better and probably would have liked to get a Droid. I like being able to personalize my settings and everything like that. The reason I didn’t was because I heard that droids are harder to make accessible. That you have to install all these different apps and such. The other reason I went with an iPhone was because all of my blind friends used it. If I got stuck or frustrated I knew I could get help. It also seemed that there was more support for the iPhone than the Droid. Which also correct me if I am wrong because I really don’t know. It is just the way things seemed to me. Also for someone using a touch screen device for the first time Voiceover seemed a bit easier to learn. Also we had an iPad and an iPhone I got to play around with a bit before I brought my 6S. There are little things that bother me about the iPhone and I wish I had more room to customize things. I still think I’d like to try a droid to see what it’s like. However I don’t have the money to spend on one for that purpose alone. Also I spent a lot of money in the app store so I can’t reason with throwing that all away. Still a lot of the apps I brought might get thrown out when Apple drops support for 32 bit apps so there’s that too. I like Siri but I wish she was more like Google Now in that she would tell you answers to searches more in that regard. I’m not unhappy with choosing an iPhone, but part of me wishes that I didn’t jump into it and took my time to really compare the 2. I was sort of in a position where my phone was beat, and I needed a new 1 quick. So even though I’m not likely to switch to Droid anytime soon. I still would like to see what it has to offer and check it out myself.

Hello all! I would like to tell my story about using an android phone. I used a samsung galaxy s3 mini phone which runned android 4.1.2. Well, i won't say it wasn't accessible. I didn't have any big issues with it. I think i wished to have is an ability to view the edited text with the volume keys and selecting text with enabling graphics with talkback. Everything that i wanted was included in android 4.3 and higher. One thing that i missed was a voice dream reader app on iPhone and other cool things, i really wanted to have an iPhone and when i got it the first app that i had purchased was a voice dream reader app and i really enjoy it and use it often for different things. Now i still use my old iPhone 5S. I'm considering to buy a new phone and I really don't know what to buy. I know that android is mostly accessible now and everything is ok with it, but i'm frustraighted that i won't be able to use it normal and adapt to it. I am so glad about the accessibility of iPhone and it's convinience that i'm not sure should i try it or not.

Heres my 2 sense. If you want to upgrade to the new iPhone, get the 8 or the X, you'll be glad you did. I'd say if you like the iPhone, stick with it. If you like android, get an android device. It's totally up to you with what you do. I went from a 6S plus to the X, so it was a huge jump, but it works wonderfully on my end and that's all that matters.

Android's ok to the point where I think security should be improved.

Great discussion. I'd like to chime in here a bit. I got my first iPhone at the end of March, and for the most part I really like it. It's an iPhone 7. But there is an issue which has really been bugging me, and I don't believe it has to do with accessibility per se but tbh I've gotten mixed answers on this. There are really 2 issues. The first one is the automatic timing out of certain websites, including Apple. But that's probably a whole discussion inandof itself. I don't think this affects their entire site, but whenever I try and log in anywhere with my Apple ID and password my session automatically times out only after a couple minutes or so. This hasn't happened that much on my Mac, probably because of the presence of a tactile keyboard. However, the issue has happened a lot thus far on my iPhone and it's really driving me batty. Touch ID only seems to work a little bit, and I'm not sure why. This issue has prevented me from downloading apps, some of which I want to become familiar with because I'm gonna start working with an O&M instructor from the place I went for iPhone tutoring. I have slight issues with hand coordination, and I think this might be coming into play. But it seems to me that there should be at least one accessibility setting which will help out with this. That leads me to my next point. I am very impressed with everything that has been done with VoiceOver and Siri on iOS, and on the Mac for that matter. My iPhone also seems to be very stable, and I like the physical design although I'm wondering if perhaps it might be contributing to the issue which I just described, lol! For the most part, I've been able to anchor one of my hands at the top and bottom of the phone, and just perform the gestures that way either with the same hand or by bringing my other hand over. I'd attend more training sessions at the same place in a heartbeat, but scheduling when someone is available to get me there and back is a bit of an issue. Paratransit isn't quite reliable enough so that I can use it to get to and from these trainings. Perhaps AppleCare might be my only other option at this point but I'll have to see.

My high school used Mac books, and for my text books. I use an iPad. After high school. I got an iPhone. I like Apple iOS, and the Apple software. It's accessible from the get go.
My issues I have with Apple are the pathetic quality control. Whether it's in the software, or hardware.
You look at the iOS updates. Yes, I can understand bugs in software that's one thing, but issues that cause phones to brick, or have some other issues that hinders the phone is something that should be looked over prior to releasing.
Same thing with the computersThe just recently released computers with the domes to help keep small particles out of the keyboard to keep from causing issue with the keyboards. Something that should have been done from the Mac books that released in 2016.
I just got my first Android phone last year in December. While it does take some getting used too. There are things I like
First off. I still have a headphone port. You can argue with me all you would like about how wireless is simple, but nothing beats the simplicity of plugging my headphones in to listen to music, or an audiobook. not to mention and this part here is just in my experience. The wireless connections when it comes to screen readers are iffy. Like it starts to cut in and out, or doesn't go through at all.
I also like the Google Assistant over Siri. I'm not sure what Apple and the idea is over Siri but it's not a smart assistant. More like a virtual assistant similar to the voice dial.
Android isn't with out it's issues.
With my experience thus far. I've had issues with some android phones where it's some altered form of Google Talkback, and that's made things more trouble.
The android keyboard is another one of them things that's made me miss the iOS keyboards.
I use dictation on and off. If I use dictation on android. I have to scroll to the keyboard icon to bring up the keyboard again, but on the iOS end of things. dictation is on the keyboard. So if I need to go back and type something that dictation misunderstood. I can.
I still use apple products, and I also use Android. They both have their good and bad.
Chuck

Between hardware changes that I can't get behind and software frustrations that seemed to be piling up, I reviewed this thread carefully earlier this year, read/listened to Jonathan Mosen's breakdowns of a couple of recent Android phones, and bought an LG V30 from EBay 4 months ago. Not only did it have a headphone jack to go with my high-end headphones, but it had the kind of audio quality I have paid hundreds for in stand-alone devices. Plus a "real" virtual assistant that knows how to say more than "I found something on the Web," a standard USB-C connector, deep customization abilities, and (one of my biggest wish items) an option to navigate by paragraph in addition to character/word/line. After several months, though, I bought another IPhone SE on EBay today to replace the one I was trying to replace before. As annoying as IOS quirks had gotten, Android's were much worse for me, in the same way that Windows can drive one up the wall: they're both all-things-for-all-people complex operating systems, and as such they trip over themselves in unpredictable ways. I was frustrated that IPhone was inadequate from my usability perspective for things like word processing, but Android's notifications screen is so full of text, and the incoming call screen as well, that I was fumbling with the phone for way too long for the simplest tasks--like answering the phone--to the point where I just didn't want to pick it up at all. I couldn't readily read the text of latest text messages on the lock screen, for instance. Google speech dictation doesn't seem any more reliable than Apple's, scary as that is, and I find the Google keyboard harder to use. The fact that things like the text messaging screen defaults to typing mode in a new message means that there are always extraneous characters in the message text box resulting from explore-by-touch (there's no keyboard option to require double-tapping of characters). Absence of the table index control type is keenly felt in the Android Oreo contacts list or list of all installed apps. Speaking of explore by touch, finger tracking just isn't nearly as refined yet on Android. I frequently get "trapped" either in the notifications top area or home button bottom area, regardless of where I tap the screen; and, quite often, tapping the screen in the app area just yields silence. This can be a problem on IOS as well, but not to this extent.
Customization within apps and applying a good launcher, and all that, took hour after hour. The thought of tweaking it more to automate tasks using Tasker just makes me tired, though I did get google assistant activating with a volume key (since there's no physical home button). It works maybe 85% of the time.
Because the V30 integrates the fingerprint reader into the power button, I found no way to bring up the lock screen to simply check the time. If I set the screen to bring up the lock screen when I tap it, it activates constantly in my shirt pocket. More than once, when I had Nearby Explorer running, it unlocked itself somehow and started calling phone numbers while I was walking with it in my pocket. My only solution was to disable all secure forms of device lock, so that I could pull up the notification and lock screens without unlocking the phone until I swipe it. Even so, the other day the phone went somehow from locked to opening up Nearby Explorer while in my shirt pocket.
Accidental taps are an issue for me on IOS as well, but neither of these things has happened starting from the lock screen.
Finally, in the absence of a magic tap, turning off a book in Bard Mobile as I fall asleep involves waking the phone screen, unlocking, and searching for the Stop button as the narrator keeps talking; problem is, TalkBack won't speak on the Lock screen while Bard is talking. Speaking of "no magic tap," I thought this would be a minor thing, but it really isn't. That's extremely evident when listening to a radio station that I want to pause while in another app or on the lock screen: the giant Android screen, if it contains playback controls at all, will lose those tiny buttons in a huge amount of other things on the screen. When I finally tried listening to music to fall asleep, I literally couldn't get it to turn off. Every time I hit pause, it would somehow start up again a few seconds later. So, into the Windows Task Manager-like Overview screen, exploring and swiping until I could find the app to force close it. Except, on that occasion, closing apps wasn't working for whatever glitchy reason. Replace all this with a two-finger double-tap on IOS and one gets the idea of a key difference overall in usability between the two platforms, for all of IOS' faults. Et cetera, etc. Maybe a Samsung would have been better in some of the hardware-related respects. I had switched back to Windows, also, and wanted Android's ability to let me send/receive texts on Windows through the Courtana app. I've never used this capability, though.
One other thing to mention is that there's no equivalent to AppleVis. I've always gotten helpful feedback here from the forums. On Eyes-Free and the BlindPhones list, not. InclusiveAndroid is a much-needed site, but can't be upheld just by a couple of people. Just not enough folks, I think.
A handset should be idiotproof and simple. I've decided that the best way for me to go is with a $200 new IPhone SE--a price I doubt will come down too much even after the new insanely-expensive models come out in a couple of weeks. At that price, I don't mind that I can't do everything with it. I just need the New York Times, KNFBReader, Seeing AI (not available on Android yet), Nearby Explorer, Weather, Safari, and the mail app (which is more usable than AquaMail Pro). Oh, and the phone. For $200? Sure, I'll take it. I wanted a handset I could do more with, but to a far greater degree, I just want a handset I don't have to think about. In fact, I would have needed to buy an IOS device anyway, because my Arlo security camera app doesn't let me edit custom mode settings on the Android version, the IDevices Connected home automation app wasn't usable on Android, Seeing AI isn't yet available on Android, there's no home automation app nearly as usable as the Apple Home app, and VoiceDream is universally said to be rather poor on Android. These are actually major factors for my typical usage.
This was my second attempt to try Android, the first being back on IceCream Sandwitch--I'm not an Apple fan. But, although "never" is a dangerous word, I can't see myself trying Android again unless Apple really blows up or eliminates all means of getting an inexpensive non-used phone off EBay. I think TalkBack is doing a fine job, and I think Android is as well. I just don't want a Windows-like experience from my handset! That's Windows on a bad day, too. Switching back was a profound and immediate relief in terms of the simplest and most-conducted tasks on a handset.

So wait your phone is 2 years old and 3 versions of Android behind. You claim apple isn’t exciting with phone updates yet you have a 2 year old phone? That’s fine, but I’m not sure of the point of this topic. If your happy with Android fine, but there is eyes free for you to go be happy with that. I love how Android people have to come and try and justify why they picked what they picked. Great you get security updates every so often the fact is your 4 versions behind current Android. Unless you have a pixel truthfully your behind the ball do to the aweful way Android pushes out updating. Does the IPhone get clunky after a few updates sure, but IOS 12 runs on phones 5 years old. I’m sorry a phone 5 years old should be a bit slower than it was the day you bought it.

I wanted to talk over this about the Talkback being slower than Talkback.
As an android and iOS user. I can see what you're saying. It is slower in some ways. Especially if you're scrolling through a large list.
It's like that with a few other areas also. VoiceOver on the other hand does have a somewhat quicker response when a finger is on something or a gesture is done.
Chuck